tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post3467584684811053735..comments2023-08-06T10:20:26.565-04:00Comments on Retired Pastor Ruminates: Pastors aren’t Prophets: Some Unsolicited Advice for Newly-Minted MinistersRichard L. Floydhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12113908222186199761noreply@blogger.comBlogger17125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-62269191859788655782010-03-07T07:23:10.691-05:002010-03-07T07:23:10.691-05:00John,
Mike and I lived next door to each other at...John,<br /><br />Mike and I lived next door to each other at Andover Newton, and were great friends. We stood side by side when we were arrested at Harrisburg, PA for protesting the war in Vietnam.<br /><br />You are right. He did serve as a student intern at Second Church Greenfield (I met Mick Comstock through him).<br /><br />After graduation he became pastor in South Deerfield. Sadly, he died while there of a coronary embolism at age 30.<br /><br />Now he was a prophet!<br /><br />Rick<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />RickRichard L. Floydhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12113908222186199761noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-8746024118235076292010-03-05T14:54:47.890-05:002010-03-05T14:54:47.890-05:00Rick,
Wasn't Mike Maguire in Greenfield, MA at...Rick,<br />Wasn't Mike Maguire in Greenfield, MA at one time. I have a vague remembrance of him there; like you, younger than me!<br /><br />JohnAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-84518648464919199602010-03-03T18:27:20.823-05:002010-03-03T18:27:20.823-05:00Thanks, John, for the good thoughts. Yes, we all ...Thanks, John, for the good thoughts. Yes, we all stand under the Word of God, a word of both judgment and grace, always a two-edged sword. We mustn't forget that.<br /><br />I was no fan of Nixon, either. But your comparison of him with Hitler, while overblown, had some truth to it, in that both misused their office. Hitler was a mass murderer in the name of the state. Nixon was just a “crook.” But it was Nixon that opened up talks with China.<br /><br />I don't think the mainline church has ever recovered from the Vietnam era. And remember when conservative evangelicals once castigated us for getting involved in politics? How times change. Now they are the base of the Republican Party.<br /><br />The first time I was in a pulpit in seminary, several people got up and walked out. They had every right. Did you know Mike Maguire? He was with me and we had just come back from a demonstration, and thought that “We will resist you” made a good litany response for the call to worship. We were so angry and arrogant then.<br /><br />So much of what I know I learned the hard way.Richard L. Floydhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12113908222186199761noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-10666609883964583782010-03-03T13:50:52.331-05:002010-03-03T13:50:52.331-05:00Rick,
Its always helpful to remember that when the...Rick,<br />Its always helpful to remember that when the prophet stands in the pulpit, he,or she, stands under the same judgment as those he or she is preaching to.You learn these things, I think. I remember that in my first church, during the Vietnam War, I think I compared Nixon to Hitler from the pulpit! I wasn't a great fan of Nixon, but that was a bit of a stretch. When preaching descends into almost entirely social commentary, then you are right, you should work for a political organization, and that's true of both left and right.<br /><br />John CedarleafAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-79154925332157653752010-03-03T07:27:51.589-05:002010-03-03T07:27:51.589-05:00Yes, David, your last point a big danger for pasto...Yes, David, your last point a big danger for pastors, and for churches. The “let the church be the church” slogan is helpful as far it goes, but congregations live not for themselves, and have social contexts.<br /><br />But by being a sign of the kingdom of God, even an imperfect one, they should transform their contexts.<br /><br />Are you the David Proctor I was at seminary with at ANTS?Richard L. Floydhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12113908222186199761noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-64818184798075011952010-03-02T23:43:41.776-05:002010-03-02T23:43:41.776-05:00Amen, Rick, from another old soul who has never to...Amen, Rick, from another old soul who has never totally fit because of such parallel contemplations. Kind of like Tom Lehrer's songs which are as true today as they were in the 1950's+. It is sad because in so many ways so many people in our world are hungry for authentic pastoral care even though they are not connected or are disconnected from religious institutions. That is also to me the danger of pastors/parish clergy who function only as internalized chaplains to those within their walls. David ProctorAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-66307440555657762132010-03-02T20:33:39.309-05:002010-03-02T20:33:39.309-05:00Thanks, Norm.
But recall that nobody listened to ...Thanks, Norm.<br /><br />But recall that nobody listened to Isaiah! And God even told him that would happen. How's that for a job description?<br /><br />Ah, the New York Times, which I read faithfully, was once referred to by somebody as “the parish newsletter of self-satisfied liberalism.” <br /><br />Are you still laboring in the rocky vineyard of the Lord?Richard L. Floydhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12113908222186199761noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-30144654268637802022010-03-02T16:38:01.191-05:002010-03-02T16:38:01.191-05:00Wise words my friend. I have learned over the year...Wise words my friend. I have learned over the years that good pastoral care and theology always trumps ideology. Isaiah still speaks better to the Wall St. barons than does the editorial page of the New York Times.<br /><br />NormAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-5586861420406506342010-03-01T21:59:07.435-05:002010-03-01T21:59:07.435-05:00Mick,
So true, P.T. Forsyth wrote about the prophe...Mick,<br />So true, P.T. Forsyth wrote about the prophetic vocation of the congregation. And you are spot on that that is one of the pastor's roles, to equip the saints for their prophetic ministry (as one piece of Calvin's description of the work of Christ, and his body the church, in the three-fold office, as you mentioned.)<br /><br />Thanks for your good comment. Our conversation yesterday got this one started. Let us talk soon.<br />RickRichard L. Floydhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12113908222186199761noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-28556603801095341382010-03-01T19:12:53.711-05:002010-03-01T19:12:53.711-05:00Rick, sometimes the life is in the pouring from a ...Rick, sometimes the life is in the pouring from a deep well, and too much time in the pot killeth. It was this that makes so much of PTF's work dynamic (in the true theological sense of that word) ... even if not always exactly right.Jason Goroncyhttp://cruciality.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-17598166079383004612010-03-01T19:10:10.730-05:002010-03-01T19:10:10.730-05:00Thanks, Rick. Echoes of our conversation yesterda...Thanks, Rick. Echoes of our conversation yesterday. My understanding is that in our denomination, it's the congregation not the pastor, that is the prophet, and the priest, and the sovereign under God of its own life. One way to put the question of the pastor and prophecy us, "how does the pastor and teacher serve the congregation's prophethood. Mick ComstockUnknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14262062360680831040noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-60649609603526292402010-03-01T18:52:40.079-05:002010-03-01T18:52:40.079-05:00Thank you so much, Jason, for your gracious commen...Thank you so much, Jason, for your gracious comment.<br /><br />Sometimes these things just pour out of you, and I've been ruminating on this one for a long time.<br /><br />RickRichard L. Floydhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12113908222186199761noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-54447595560732232762010-03-01T18:27:20.921-05:002010-03-01T18:27:20.921-05:00Rick,
This is (easily) among the best blog posts ...Rick,<br /><br />This is (easily) among the best blog posts I've read in ages. I'm going to share it with all of my students, and (if you don't mind) re-post it. There's wisdom here that needs to be shared.<br /><br />With deep thanks,<br /><br />JasonJason Goroncyhttp://cruciality.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-81805291864747639142010-03-01T14:38:55.877-05:002010-03-01T14:38:55.877-05:00Thanks for your comment, Josh. We all are newly-...Thanks for your comment, Josh. We all are newly-minted sometime. In some ways those were some of the best years of my ministry. Blessings on yours.<br /><br />RickRichard L. Floydhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12113908222186199761noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-78766752004307852572010-03-01T14:37:25.649-05:002010-03-01T14:37:25.649-05:00Hi Lesley,
You're welcome. Hope you are thri...Hi Lesley,<br /><br />You're welcome. Hope you are thriving.<br /><br />Thanks for the comment,<br /><br />RickRichard L. Floydhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12113908222186199761noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-44479913107109159152010-03-01T14:35:02.480-05:002010-03-01T14:35:02.480-05:00Thanks, Rick, from a newly-minted minister with an...Thanks, Rick, from a newly-minted minister with an agenda or two. - Josh CramerAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8935942607987614770.post-34568418834560375112010-03-01T14:17:25.850-05:002010-03-01T14:17:25.850-05:00Moving and thought-provoking. Thanks for this, Ric...Moving and thought-provoking. Thanks for this, Rick.Lesley Ann Becknoreply@blogger.com